Starship Troopers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvLoqexj6v0

The original book is used in part of training for the army,navy,and marines. This is the only book recommended as part of training for three of the four U.S. military branches.

In the book and the movies only citizens (people who served in any branch of their military)have the right to vote.

The book also had critic of supporting Fascism and Communism. In the movie the symbol for the federation is an iron hawk in front of a globe,and their high intelligence officers uniform looks like that of the gestapo.

I'm not saying it's a bad movie just that the book is some how supportive of fascism,racism,and government controlled media.

I would like your opinion.

Tags: Justice, book, etc., peace, totalerism, war

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Permalink Reply by Huwdlum on October 18, 2008 at 12:12pm

i have complete respect and recognition for what you did overseas and for all of the hell you've seen and possibly the people you've killed and didn't have to. (I don't know). I can say completely that i have 110% support and respect for you and 0 respect for the president. however, the president is someone that you have to support no mater what. at least until his illegal doings become evident to the entire world. then the biggest revolution of all will pursue...

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Permalink Reply by medicineman on October 27, 2008 at 11:49pm

oye. guys....listen. At least in the Navy/Marine Corps, the majority of our guys don't need the money for college. We all came in for different reasons, the major reason for my marines.. (and none of you are going to like this at all....I'll be waiting for the baby killer comments as soon as I'm done with this post) they wanted to fight. It was the war we all grew up wanting to fight. We grew up on GI Joe and other violent media, and when the time came for us to be heroes, we took up the uniform...and were profoundly disappointed. Now we're back, we've done our time, and now most of us are civilians again. We're no different than you, we just don't like loud noises, or being a crowded room with no way out, it's a thing...we'll deal with it.

It's not so much the president I have to support, I just have to follow his orders. I can call him a freakin' idiot, (just not to the media) and be just fine, but I can't go against his orders, nor those of my superiors.

and starship troopers isn't required by the military, it's recommended reading, but not required. and to be honest, I like the idea of citizens vs. everyone else. and I'll tell you why. In the book, a citizen earned the right to vote by being informed, by making a sacrifice, and by understanding truly whats at stake at the elections.

It's a lot better than the mob mentality that follows the more popular of the two candidates that they know of because it's "hip" to do so. There's a few more that don't garner any media attention, and I think that if people were more informed, or had to earn their citizenship, they would know that and vote smartly, instead of along party lines or some other useless standard.

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Permalink Reply by Xeranar on October 27, 2008 at 11:59pm

You are certainly not a baby killer, a sadist perhaps, but no baby killer. You're certainly a classic Jar-head. Socially repressive, interested in fighting, indifferent to pacifism. The kind of person I want fighting my wars but we created a democratic republic for a reason. Military service was never required because militia service was expected and being a well prepared killer doesn't make you any more informed about voting or politics.

If you want to find informed individuals get a degree in political science. Also calling Obama the candidate of the ill-informed is insulting. The man has better policies than the last several presidents including Bill Clinton and because he motivated young intellectuals to vote for him he is a pandering populist.

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Permalink Reply by medicineman on October 28, 2008 at 12:37am

whoa..um..not a marine. I'm a corpsman. I'm their medic. Guess they mustve rubbed off on me. and I knew that when I wrote the "hip" comment that I would instantly be thought of as anti-obama.
well...since ron paul isn't running, I'll vote for obama.

Well prepared killer? Indifferent to pacifism? ouch...I'm an ardent proponent of not killing people. I know...I'm wearing a uniform in my picture, so I must be a sadistic mass murderer, but...no, I'm not going to go into my experiences just to prove a point, but believe me when I say that I've seen the innocent die, and nothing is harder than knowing you could save a child, but you were just too damn slow.

Being in the military does not make anyone a well prepared killer, and alot of the people in, aren't infantry and special forces, I know it may seem that way, but I got a buddy of mine who works in admin, dealing with criminal cases every day.

But boy is that guy a "killer"

I'm not calling anyone a pandering populist, because they ALL are. McCain's going to get the conservative christians, and obama will hopefully get more and stop this moral majority nonesense, (odd how the "moral" people keep sending us to war) I'm not saying it should be done, because it does violate the basic principles of our nation, but...EVERYONE should know the issues and not vote as I said earlier, along party lines OR popularity.

and here's a little tip. The GI Joe comment? I can almost guarantee that most vets you talk to will tell you they went for some grand reason, to defend democracy, to help people, that sort of thing.
Bull.
Our generation grew up on violence, cartoons, movies, video games. We grew up on it, we loved it, our childhood games revolved around violence, and when the war came, those of us who grew up doing that jumped at the chance to play the game for real. Maybe I'm just jaded in my view of humanity, but for the majority of people I've spoken to, they came there to fight. They'll never tell the real story because they don't want to be labeled as insane, but it's the truth.

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Permalink Reply by Xeranar on October 28, 2008 at 1:25am

whoa..um..not a marine. I'm a corpsman. I'm their medic. Guess they mustve rubbed off on me. and I knew that when I wrote the "hip" comment that I would instantly be thought of as anti-obama.
well...since ron paul isn't running, I'll vote for obama.

It is absolutely alright, we all have our moments. I know I think about violence more than most people will admit to. I've not been tested for sociopath tendencies but I also will remain untested so as not to lose my place at the university.

Being in the military does not make anyone a well prepared killer, and alot of the people in, aren't infantry and special forces, I know it may seem that way, but I got a buddy of mine who works in admin, dealing with criminal cases every day.

But boy is that guy a "killer"

I was explaining my point in exaggeration for the sake of argument. I know not everybody who enters the military exits some depraved killer who is simply looking for his next mission. Most will never fire a rifle in strife. But in the end it doesn't really make you anymore qualified to vote than you were before you entered.

and here's a little tip. The GI Joe comment? I can almost guarantee that most vets you talk to will tell you they went for some grand reason, to defend democracy, to help people, that sort of thing.
Bull.
Our generation grew up on violence, cartoons, movies, video games. We grew up on it, we loved it, our childhood games revolved around violence, and when the war came, those of us who grew up doing that jumped at the chance to play the game for real. Maybe I'm just jaded in my view of humanity, but for the majority of people I've spoken to, they came there to fight. They'll never tell the real story because they don't want to be labeled as insane, but it's the truth.

I hate to admit I was in college when 9/11 happened and I thought about switching from History to go to grad school for medicine. Become a military doctor. In the end I stuck with history but I still have a tinge to go off and play soldier in some respect. Misguided nationalism no doubt, but since I know that in my head I have a hard time giving absolute respect to soldiers as you do.

We both know a majority of the men in the military did it for nationalism, money for college, or just as an excuse to leave home, and perhaps kill someone. Before Vietnam we had to draft people and those men were just doing it for the sake of not going to prison. Some came home with seriously lofty hearts and ideals of why they went.

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Permalink Reply by Huwdlum on October 28, 2008 at 5:04pm

wow, corpsman...
you must have seen alot.

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Permalink Reply by medicineman on October 28, 2008 at 11:55pm

What I saw isn't worth talking about.

i guess that's why my view of humanity is so messed up, I'm not saying the gi joe mentality is the right thing, but it's the main thing out there. I know, I had it when I got there. It took exactly one mass casualty to focus on why I was there, to save lives, but it was still there, in the back of my mind.

We wanted to be heroes, we wanted to fight for all the right causes, do something with our lives, and just be heroes. We grew up wanting to be heroes, we were exposed to heroic siutations every day we turned on the television, it's ingrained within us, I do apologize if this offends, but it's the truth.

and you wanna know something? I hate fighting. I hate violence, yes...I do like to watch on youtube when it gets visited upon an insurgent or two, but I hate violence. Because violence begets violence, and shedding blood does nothing but cause more people to die. I am tired of picking up the dead and dying, I am tired of trying to stop someones child from bleeding to death because they were the wrong sect of a religion, or they were the wrong name, or they were just in the wrong place when some.....insurgent decided it was time to detonate a truck full of chlorine gas and explosives, I am tired of uncovering mass graves, and I am tired of death....period.

My point is simple, the majority of us came to fight, due in no small part to our cihldhood filled with violent television and video games. In WW2, I don't know the exact percentage, but when engaged, only a very few of the americans would try to kill their opponents, everyone else fired for effect. (This is a true study...please don't lose your minds) In Iraq? Nearly everyone tries to take the enemy out, it takes a certain...."instinct" to do that, something that is ingrained in you. Do I "blame" television for creating this? Good lord no, but it sure as hell helped.

and the baby killer and mass murderer thing? I have been called that to my face in more airports than I would care to imagine.

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Permalink Reply by Xeranar on October 29, 2008 at 10:57pm

It is difficult for me to feel sorry for that, because it isn't a damn video game. It is a child and no name of democracy justifies that. It doesn't take "instinct" to take out the enemy it takes ego. It takes ego to support this, it is the ego that prevents the American from putting the m16 down and say this shot isn't protecting my brother and it isn't bringing more meaning to my life, it is killing another human being.

But what if somebody half-way around the world holds the view that the United States should be annihilated for its position on globalism and their repressive government likes it the way it is? There are just wars, there are geopolitical wars, and there are wars that are smack dab in the middle. Afghanistan is more the former, Iraq more the latter, but neither is by any means a pointless empty grab.

Everyone is defeated by intentional death of another person who you haven't even heard out, and no man or women ever forgets what they have done....but heck what do I know, everyone just go watch Saw 5 instead of investigating why this is happening. I mean it's just a video game where your pride is the prize after beating the final boss at the end stage, right?

The fact that the Taliban had laws that allowed capital punishment to woman over basic human rights justifies intentional murder of the opposition. Though that is solely my desensitized opinion on the matter. I see you are a complete pacifist or an isolationist. The two positions are really indistinguishable when to the scrutiny of stopping human rights violations.

I think more of us soldiers should be pointing out this isn't really a profession to be admired. The person in the uniform might be respectable but the profession....I am having a hard time finding pride in this profession, especially when people are joining a video game.

Who brought up the video game metaphor? Did I miss that? I think medicineman mentioned it in passing as a desensitization tool but I don't think he directly compared Iraq to a video game. Maybe he did...

The point I am making here is that you viciously despise anybody who willing goes to war but yet not a peep when human rights are violated it seems. Maybe I am missing the point, maybe you hate human rights being violated but because you hate military intervention you think talking people to death will solve it.

I'm a firm believer in interventionism. I'm not saying we go pick a fight with a country for no good reason but if Bush had simply said "Yes, I hate Saddam, he is a bad leader and his rule of terror has to end to allow the people of Iraq or a subdivision of countries to be ruled in a democratic way" I would have been alright with it. The overthrowing of bad dictators is in the best interest of humanity. If that means people have to die, so be it. Everybody in 100 years (barring another dictator in Iraq) will be mildly pleased that Saddam was overthrown.

Permalink Reply by society? on October 31, 2008 at 10:22am

Ive been saying exactly that for ages, there's no excuse for war and its all really just senseless murder, but never with such eloquence.
i agree completely and thank you for putting into words how i feel.

Permalink Reply by MadAsHell_RBG on October 29, 2008 at 12:01pm

Bro, I see where you are going w/ the theme of the book/ movie, but i spent 5 years active duty in the Navy, and assuming or somehow implying that the book is used by the branches of the service is absurd and a complete mideducated fallacy. U think they use star trek techniques too???

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Permalink Reply by MadAsHell_RBG on October 29, 2008 at 12:06pm

Wasting your time blogging about effin starship troopers is insignificant and basically like pissing in the wind... I'm sure you can come up w/ a more pertinent discussion to stimulate the minds of the masses, other than spreading an uneducated perspective...